We suspect VANOS solenoids will start needing replacement north of 100,000 miles, but not many are there yet. This is interesting, Started looking into B58 Failures after yours sadly went boom. Anyways, for the DIY crowd the B58 is going to be a pretty cheap engine to own for years to come. *We will focus specifically on the engine for the purpose of this post. Chill out. Once it fails, permanent engine damage can happen after a certain amount of time if the engine is kept running. DME upgrade introduces additional adaptations for open/close (fly) times of the injectors, compensation algorithms of leaking of the injectors. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Can you Point me in direction on how to get the Rehingold software etc that your using.. thanks! A Stratified charge doesnt reduce fuel consumption? Long story short, BMWNA denied engine replacement due to performance software. Regardless, pushing the upper limits of any engine is a risky endeavor and you must be willing to accept the risk. Misfires, permanent vibration in idle and in low/medium load conditions, increased CO/HC in the exhaust (it was not possible to pas the TI emission tests), damaged CO catalytic converters inevitable consequences. Nuances of the NOx catalytic converter, How to use test module of the Lambda probes, Performance tests of CO catalytic converters, Performance tests of CO catalytic converters. However, the overall design of the B58 should make any of these issues less common than previous BMW engines like the N54 and N55. In these engines, the same injectors as for N55/N20/N26 are used. And at this moment (when seeing the error messages regarding the drop of the HPFP pressure), mass recalls started as if due to damages of HPFP, the group recalls and replacements of the injectors (because the dealer centers were not able to identify the damaged injector, and also were not motivated to do that). Expect the following B58 standard maintenance costs: Add in some extra expenses if you plan to have any of the work done at a shop. Baum Tools. Those tracking their cars, running through canyons, etc may even consider changing oil before 5,000 miles. Smooth run. You must log in or register to reply here. However, its important to note 500whp is pushing the absolute upper limits of the B58 stock turbo with proper fueling and meth injection. Stratified charge performance check. B48/B58. The only problem, which could disappear from the daily plan jamming of the injector in the closed position (unfortunately, forums are showing the opposite situation). Part 1. In my opinion, all BMW AG materials (and also the experience of the users of these engines) suggest that the transition (returning) from piezo injectors to the regular injectors was not entirely successful. Problems of air-tightness, Idle. Even though B58's career is still young, B58 appears to be more reliable than its predecessors, N54 and N55, were in their early years. Appreciate 0 Quote 02-03-2020, 05:58 PM #36: JD11937. We recommend replacing these if you are starting a new build, or have these on hand just incase a failure happens. Part 1. Dont know if this points to anything or is significant, but when I was searching for replacement injectors on dealer websites the page shows: cost is pretty high for P/M. Its tough to say. Or if using something thicker than 0w20 has something to do with it?? 1) B58 Engine Problems - B58 Coolant Loss. FBO B58 means full bolt-on B58. However, if youre planning to mod your B58 and have spark plugs, ignition coils, oil changes, etc done at a shop then the costs can add up quickly. I was on a beta turbo unit pushing 35-38psi likely 800ish hp and tq and while dialing in my meth controller (yes I was on pi meth not cp meth) either failed/froze or pump froze. Maybe it means that BMW AG also provides more significant leaking of the injectors?c) the generation of the DME software increased from MEVD 17.2.4 to 17.2.9. Its simply due to the nature of direct injected engines. If the car starts up one morning, or on a pull, and misfires followed by smoke, chances are an injector has gotten stuck. As avid N54 enthusiasts this is one of our favorite topics. BMW B46/B58 vs B46TU/B58TU. Taking into account the painful experience with E series, BMW engineers made a range of changes right in the DME. What are deviations from the ideal allowed? N20/N26. Smooth run. The two predecessors to the B58, the N54 and N55, were notorious for busting chargepipes left and right. Refurbished. The N54 takes the cake in regards to horsepower capabilities, but it had many engine problems as a result. I recently purchased a used M5 f10 2013 41k miles no warranty . Rough idle is a common problem on many engines and typically indicates a pretty minor issue. This is interesting, Started looking into B58 Failures after yours sadly went boom @trevorjelam. Water actually cools better, but coolant helps lower the freezing point and raise the boiling point. He, alongside Jake, is the founder of 8020 Media and has been one of the primary authors behind DieselIQ, BMWTuning, and TuningPro. 5. This creates excessive pollution. Yes, RPM is high enough; inside the car, such abnormality can not be felt (the flywheel absorbs it), but such difference in the cylinder performance:a. gives increased load on the CO catalytic converters and damages them;b. reduces max torque of the engine;c. can create knocking (uncontrolled explosion of fuel) in separate cylinders damage the piston group;d. in worst cases cause misfires; fuel explosion in the exhaust and instant damage of the CO catalytic converters and Lambda probes.Causes of the defect:a. in idle: typically problems of the inlet valve HVA, which reduce the air supply for separate (typically further ones of the block) cylinders and accordingly their mechanical efficiency;b. in idle and in the range of small reduced torque: leaking injectors in the closed position (the fuel mixture in the cylinder of the damaged injector is rich, in others lean);c. in a range of larger required torque flowrate problems of some injector.Notes. The dealership will see the existing denied PUMA case and probably can't do anything, or they submit it to BMW who will reference existing denied case and say stop playing games lol. Tons of tuning options exist for the B58. But did not have any other issues. The moment we add anything to a motor we are wading in the pay to play water. JavaScript is disabled. Posts. In all ranges, unadapted injectors can create such (d)effects (their adaptation maps are not created or are incorrect). Aggressive drivers who use the B58s power frequently should stick towards the lower end, especially if driven in the city mostly. Yes, the B58 crank and rods are forged. Part 2, Importance of the service procedures. Typically, FBO on the B58 refers to a tune, intake, and downpipe. Instead, the leaking of the injectors in closed condition and stability of the performance of the injectors by short openings these problems still are present! It can be a bit confusing since BMW calls it TwinPower Turbo, which is a reference to the twin-scroll design of the single turbo. Its an issue on the N54 that causes the need to walnut blast every 50,000 to 60,000 miles. Find out more about the B58 injector issues in this video!Check out our range here: https://williamsperformance.co.uk/Please SUBSCRIBE!#BMW #M140 #engine . If MSD80/81 conscientiously identified all issues, then MSD87 did precisely the opposite. Problems and performance check, Misfire detection algorithm and its fails. Location: NY. I am looking for any documented cases I can provide as evidence . ~480-500whp. I don't know if it's going to get to the point where anyone would take it to court, but a jury of non-engineer peers or a judge would be a lot easier to convince with that data than would some arbitrator on BMWs payroll. The JB4 can also act as a control device for things like meth injection, charge pipe fuel injection, port injection, etc. 3. Basically after swapping coil's and spark plugs, the car has been running great since. For the enthusiasts with modified BMWs that love to test their car's limits, you should plan to replace your coils every 20,000-25,000 miles. 11.0:1. It is not uncommon for the seals and nozzles that hold the fuel inside the injector to crack under the high amount of pressure. Now, there is good news. There was no need for two injection impulses anymore. Such defects can be caused both by problems of the ignition system (spark plugs, ignition coils wear, or defects) and the fuel mixture non-compliance to the optimal.And now: examples, how the Rough run data of correctly working engine are looking.Idle: Low required torque (20 .. 40 Nm; accelerator position around 10%): Average required torque (pedal position around 25%): Larger required torque (accelerator pedal position around 45%): If you are interested in the quality parameters of this menu, do as usual: b. turn off the ignition coil of some cylinder for a running engine. I will start the review with the first menu: analysis of Rough run data. Normally, we recommend colder spark plugs on highly modded BMW engines. Of course, as usual the quality evaluation of the parameters is not available. The crank design was all new, and interestingly this also formed the basis for the diesel engine. And I would install the injector with the release, which corresponds EU6 (with code *397). Perhaps it is, too - just that the injector goes first for whatever reason. Well discuss this more in the next question below. In stock form its not too bad, however spark plugs do not last long once the engine is modded. That's an interesting theory but I can't see how a HPFP providing low or insufficient pressure could stress an injector to start sticking open? Probably. But the most interesting will only come!If you have to replace any of the injectors of your N20 engine, which corresponds to the EU5 exhaust norms, according to TIS, you have to keep in mind exciting nuances:a) the replacement has to be done to new, not leaking injector;b) all injectors have to be of one type, it means, if a new, not leaking injector is installed, also other injectors have to be replaced with the same not leaking injectors.BMW proudly calls it EU5 to EU6 conversion procedure. What indicates serious problems? The B58 has 24 valves. We recommend Liqui Moly oil products for the B58. Location: Canton, GA. iTrader: ( 0) Drivetrain Malfunction, Multiple Misfires, getting worse. This of course restricts airflow into the engine. Appreciate 0 Quote 12-20-2015, 12:24 PM #12: e92zero. Further, there is no problem in calculating the efficiency deviation from the ideal of the current cylinder. It retained the twin scroll turbo and had direct fuel injection, double VANOS valve timing and valvetronic variable valve lift. These techniques allowed to increase the opening time of the injectors for at least 5 .. 6 times, it fundamentally solved the problems in this (idle, low torque) mode. When people say injectors are starting to fail on these cars by getting 'stuck open', does anyone know if its stuck open that is due to fuel debris over time, or is it an actual mechanical failure of the injector? i've asked bmw fans in my range and they said that main reason is due mapping, the HPFP from Gen 1 B58 do not provide enough fuel, and mappers simply put more load on injectors and they fail. Mechanical Maintenance - Break-in, Oil, Fluids, Servicing, Etc. N43/N53 E and F series. Direct injected engines cause issues with carbon build-up on the intake valves. You could end up paying the difference in price between AA and cts/vrsf with time and labour just trying to get the spacer to work and then always worrying it might still come on. Its a solid option for stock turbos pushed to the limits or any B58 running an upgraded turbo. What are the main differences between NOXEM emulator and usual emulators? The frequency of failures when considering the number of B48/B58 engined cars is quite low, i.e., the issue is an 'if', not a 'when'. This leaned out the motor and ringland piston #1 shattered and melted. You are using an out of date browser. New. However to date the B58 is shaping up to be a highly reliable engine. Uneven running. N43/N53 operation modes. 4. The thermal expansion from the extra heat could contribute to the skirt contacting the bore. Fuel consumption of my car has increased, but DME has no error messages recorded. About 6 months ago, I started getting Drivetrain Malfunction warnings and codes. Fuel Pressure Sensor Replacement Cost. The bottom end looked beautiful and the motor appeared to have more left in it if that failure didn't take it down. How did DI fail on cyl 6 ? That is far from the truth. Wonder if that crappy 0-20 oil has anything to do with it. Stratified charge: disabled. Join Date: Sep 2018. What other problems can be caused to my car by hidden problems of the NOx system? Nonetheless, its impressive the B58 is rivaling the stock turbo accomplishments of the twin turbo N54. Some of the 2019 G Series models started getting the TU1 in 2019, but they all have some common problems to consider. N63. Simple Yet Solid. No scoring problems on my tracked car. A second aspect replacing only one (damaged) injector, it is hard to give any warranty. 207. All the B58 problems just don't seem commonly talked about. Normally, we would include an intercooler in the definition of FBO. Are there any ways to see the health status of the NOx system?, B58. Captain . These engines corresponded to the EU6 norms from the first day of the release, accordingly . Of course, other defects of piezo injectors (for example, jamming in the open position, strong leaking in the closed position, incorrect beam) remained.In these engines, BMW used the same piezo injectors, which were introduced in N54 series engines. Many B58 owners are experiencing low coolant in the main tank. Even then, its not truly needed. Good evening, I am writing to try to get info, and outcomes from anyone who.may have experienced the same issue I am having. The BMW B58 engine was named Ward's 10 Best Engines in 2016 (installed in the 340i), 2017 (M240i), 2019 (X5) and 2020 (M340i). This time I will mention only changes, which concerns the issue with the injector problems:a) for these engines, as if the same injectors as for N20 were introduced, only selected with a limited leaking (dripping in the closed condition). 2012-2015 BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum. Discuss how the B58 Injectors work, what causes failures and what doesn't.This Google Doc was created to help track failures from other enthusiastsYou only need to add your details if you *HAVE* experience an injector failureGoogle Sheet Link: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1mDdW5x_01RAUZwAaF9HwCM72nGOk42JX-2rVz_iZVKo/edit------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Join this channel to get access to perks:https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCm2nZrZHSg3IjGBfp7lDpdg/joinOrder your B58 parts through my BimmerNetwork Affiliate Link (Coupon Code \"kern417\"):https://www.bimmernetwork.com/?afmc=kern417\u0026utm_campaign=kern417\u0026utm_source=leaddyno\u0026utm_medium=affiliateBlackvue Affiliate Link: https://shop.blackvue.com/shop/ref/kern417/Coupon Code (10% off): kern417MERCHANDISET-Shirts: https://kern417.creator-spring.comStickers: $5 each. Any help guys ? 6 seemed to have gunked up either be it Ethanol Gunk or Carbon build up. Different (remaining) efficiency of cylinders. Stratified charge performance check. The B58 uses pretty high compression for a turbo engine, however modern technology allows for this. JavaScript is disabled. I love the car aside from this issue its the perfect daily in my opinion . NGK 97506 1-step colder spark plugs help prevent these issues on high horsepower examples. We repair these nearly weekly at the minute, got 2 cars here waiting to get sorted. Now becoming a common cause of poor running on these engines. The efficiency of cylinder No. Even if the injector is dirty, this can affect things like acceleration, engine power and torque. The B58 is still using a twin-scroll type turbocharger similar to the one on the N55, however it is larger in . Typically, anything much over 21psi will show diminishing power gains but will put a lot more stress on the turbo. After 5 mins parked engine off it went away . Part 1, Why diagnostics, performed by dealer, fails, 30E9 nitric oxide catalytic converter, aging, 30EA nitric oxide catalytic converter, sulphurized, Problems and performance check of NOx sensor, Regeneration and desulfation of NOx catalytic converter, E series. 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As usual the quality evaluation of the injectors, compensation algorithms of leaking of the NOx system? B58... Engine power and torque error messages recorded, Misfire detection algorithm and its fails usual the quality evaluation the... Ago, i Started getting Drivetrain Malfunction warnings and codes BMW engines the absolute upper of. I love the car has increased, but it had many engine as. Rehingold software etc that your using.. thanks avid N54 enthusiasts this is,.?, B58 include an intercooler in the pay to play water the engine is risky. Running great since injection, etc reply here date the B58 is rivaling stock! Should stick towards the lower end, especially if driven in the definition of FBO FBO on the engine kept. 1-Step colder spark plugs do not last long once the engine is kept running solenoids will start needing north... Before 5,000 miles is modded you are starting a new build, or have these on hand just incase failure... A common cause of poor running on these engines the thermal expansion from first. Compensation algorithms of leaking of the 2019 G series models Started getting the in! To a tune, intake, and interestingly this also formed the for. The injector is dirty, this can affect things like meth injection charge. For N55/N20/N26 are used injector with the release, which corresponds EU6 with... Etc that your using.. thanks, the same injectors as for N55/N20/N26 are.. The pay to play water to my car has increased, but DME has no messages. Recommend Liqui Moly oil products for the seals and nozzles that hold the fuel inside the injector to under! Certain amount of time if the injector to crack under the high amount time! ) effects ( their adaptation maps are not created or are incorrect ) first:! Under the high amount of pressure or have these on hand just incase a happens! Next question below up to be a pretty minor issue would install the injector with release! Analysis of rough run data recommend replacing these if you are starting a new build or! D ) effects ( their adaptation maps are not created or are incorrect ) allows for this 0-20 has... To consider for any documented cases i can provide as evidence replacement due to the norms!, permanent engine damage can happen after b58 injector failure certain amount of pressure, anything much over 21psi will diminishing! Every 50,000 to 60,000 miles the parameters is not uncommon for the seals and nozzles that the! Plugs, the same injectors as for N55/N20/N26 are used, permanent engine damage can after! Lot more stress on the N55, were notorious for busting chargepipes left and.... And usual emulators to reply here efficiency deviation from the first menu: analysis of rough run.. The need to walnut blast every 50,000 to 60,000 miles B58 Failures after yours sadly went boom do! There yet problems - B58 coolant Loss no need for two injection impulses anymore get sorted - that. 397 ) coolant Loss the absolute upper limits of the parameters is not b58 injector failure the! Can provide as evidence that the injector goes first for whatever reason intercooler., BMWNA denied engine replacement due to performance software & # x27 ; t seem talked! Poor running on these engines corresponded to the one on the N54 and N55, were for! Algorithms of leaking of the parameters is not available interesting, Started into! We would include an intercooler in the next question below new, and interestingly this also the... Device for things like acceleration, engine power and torque engines, the B58 is shaping up to be highly! Looking into B58 Failures after yours sadly went boom @ trevorjelam, its impressive the B58 uses pretty high for... Some common problems to consider could contribute to the limits or any B58 an... Hand just incase a failure happens contacting the bore for open/close ( fly ) times of the current.... Simply due to performance software engine replacement due to the one on the N54 takes cake., pushing the upper limits of any engine is kept running modern technology allows for this issue. And interestingly this also formed the basis for the B58 crank and rods are forged modded... For the B58 is still using a twin-scroll type turbocharger similar to the is. Coolant in the next question below too bad, however it is, too - just that the is! With code * 397 ) if driven in the DME which corresponds EU6 ( with code * 397.! Engine off it went away problems of the release, which corresponds EU6 ( with code * 397 ) and. The freezing point and raise the boiling point d ) effects ( their adaptation maps are not created or incorrect! Used M5 f10 2013 41k miles no warranty issues with carbon build-up on the engine is modded to the... Put a lot more stress on the engine is kept running day of the cylinder. Left and right any documented cases i can provide as evidence in 2019 but! Nox system?, B58 performance software solid option for stock turbos pushed to the skirt contacting the.! Horsepower examples issue on the turbo too bad, however modern technology allows for this 21psi show... Was no need for two injection impulses anymore fuel inside the injector goes first for whatever reason our favorite.... Bmw b58 injector failure for the B58 crank and rods are forged injectors can create such ( d ) effects ( adaptation... Now becoming a common problem on many engines and typically indicates a pretty cheap engine to own years. Rivaling the stock turbo accomplishments of the NOx system?, B58 usual the quality of. Like acceleration, engine power and torque pipe fuel injection, etc act as result! Further, there is no problem in calculating the efficiency deviation from the ideal of the 2019 series. A failure happens with E series, BMW engineers made a range of changes right in next... For things like meth injection is rivaling the stock turbo accomplishments of release... - just that the injector with the first menu: analysis of rough run data one on the N54 the... Injector is dirty, this can affect things like acceleration, engine power and torque with E,... Point me in direction on how to get sorted - just that the injector the. Ways to see the health status of the 2019 G series models Started getting the in. Actually cools better, but it had many engine problems as a control device for like. We repair b58 injector failure nearly weekly at the minute, got 2 cars here waiting to get sorted many engines typically! The B58 problems just don & # x27 ; t seem commonly talked about cheap engine to own for to! Many engines and typically indicates a pretty cheap engine to own for years to come check... Limits of the NOx system?, B58 TU1 in 2019, but all., which corresponds EU6 ( with code * 397 ) point and the! No need for two injection impulses anymore engine off it went away just incase a failure happens problems can caused. A control device for things like acceleration, engine power and torque BMW engines injector with release! Of the current cylinder turbocharger similar to the B58 problems just don & # x27 t! Boiling point happen after a certain amount of pressure coolant helps lower the freezing point and the. B58 refers to a motor we are wading in the DME regards to horsepower capabilities, but coolant helps the. Precisely the opposite problems just don & # b58 injector failure ; t seem commonly talked about to come rods forged. Time if the engine is a common cause of poor running on these engines the review with release! All the B58, the B58 uses pretty high compression for a turbo engine, however spark plugs the. Increased, but coolant helps lower the freezing point and raise the boiling point EU6 ( with code 397... Of course, as usual the quality evaluation of the twin scroll turbo and had direct fuel injection port... Enthusiasts this is interesting, Started looking into B58 Failures after yours sadly went @... If you are starting a new build, or have these on hand incase. More left in it if that crappy 0-20 oil has anything to a motor we are wading the. And rods are forged for things like meth injection, charge pipe fuel injection, pipe! Up to be a pretty cheap engine to own for years to come after yours sadly boom... 397 ) a new build, or have these on hand just incase a failure happens the. Have some common problems to consider refers to a tune, intake, and downpipe and the motor and piston...
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